this post was submitted on 22 Jun 2025
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[–] merc@sh.itjust.works -1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I see what you're saying here: if the media prints lies from a government it's not the media lying, it's the government

If the government manages to fool the media, yeah. If the government says to the media "the truth is X, but we're going to pretend that it's Y, so you print Y, ok?" and then the media goes along with it, then you can blame the media. In many cases, the media isn't able to fact check the things the government tells them. But, relaying what the government is saying is still important. Similarly, even though the media can't independently fact check the numbers that the Gaza Health Ministry reports, it's still valuable to have those numbers released too.

If the media is lazy about their fact checking you can call them lazy, but you can't call them liars, because lying requires knowing the truth and intentionally saying something untrue.

Here's the thing: if a government lies all the fucking time and the media keeps printing what the government claims anyway, then that makes them complicit in spreading the government's lies.

If the government says "the truth is X" and then the media says "X is true" then sure, you're right. But, if the media says "the government said that the truth is X", then it's up to readers / viewers to understand that the media isn't endorsing what the government said as being true, the media is simply telling you what was said.

The media doesn't get to wash its hands of the things it prints just because it puts "Israel says" before the headline.

Why should it need to wash its hands? That is exactly what Israel said. Because Israel has a complete ban on reporters in Gaza, for example, there's no way to corroborate or refute what Israel said. It's newsworthy to repeat what Israel said, but you can't blame the media when someone reads that and assumes that the government is telling the truth. As you said yourself, the government lies all the time, so why would you assume that "the government said X happened" means that "X happened".

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 2 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Because Israel has a complete ban on reporters in Gaza, for example, there’s no way to corroborate or refute what Israel said. It’s newsworthy to repeat what Israel said, but you can’t blame the media when someone reads that and assumes that the government is telling the truth

If there's no way to corroborate or refute what Israel said, don't print what Israel said. Lies aren't newsworthy, except as a way to report on the lies themselves for the purpose of debunking them.

Remember when Israel first started bombing hospitals and blamed Islamic Jihad for it? They still don't claim responsibility for Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, but after a year of targeting hospitals and doctors it's ridiculous to deny it at this point.

Yet there were few retractions or corrections. As far as CNN and The Guardian are concerned, Israel didn't bomb that hospital. What a joke.

As you said yourself, the government lies all the time, so why would you assume that “the government said X happened” means that “X happened”.

I don't think people make that assumption anymore, but that's because people stopped trusting the media. They published and promoted so many government lies that they've destroyed their own credibility.

People expect the media to investigate government claims and to publish the truth, not just parrot the lies they're fed. When the media doesn't do that, when all the major news outlets become court stenographers, people lose faith in the media.

Maybe people are expecting too much, but that's what people have been taught to expect. They were taught that journalists find the truth and report on it. They're finding out that journalists basically just print what their sources say and they can't just trust things because they're in the news anymore.

And it's going to get worse forever.

[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 0 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

If there's no way to corroborate or refute what Israel said, don't print what Israel said.

Why? What they said is newsworthy.

"Israel bombed this building"

"Why?"

"Dunno, didn't ask."

Even if you don't believe the answer, getting an answer is still newsworthy. Everyone should be aware that it's not necessarily the truth, but it's newsworthy as the justification they're using. If it comes out later that the building was an orphanage, you can't use that to challenge the government's justification that it was a command and control center if you never got them on the record saying they bombed it because it was a command and control center.

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 2 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

They don't report Russia's claims this way. They don't report Iran's claims this way.

And people can see it, which is why they don't trust the media anymore.

[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 hours ago

Russia claimed to have captured Mariupol on Friday in what would be its biggest victory yet in its war with Ukraine

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/russia-ukraine-war-1.6460410

President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said on Friday that Ukraine was working on

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/zelenskiy-says-ukraine-developing-interceptor-drones-counter-russian-attacks-2025-06-20/

According to the Ukrainian Air Force, Russia deployed 368 aerial weapons, including 352 attack drones

https://kyivindependent.com/russian-drone-and-missile-attack-killed-7-injured-dozens-across-ukraine-over-past-day/

Iran says it launched an attack on United States forces at Al Udeid Air Base.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2025/6/23/live-iran-vows-to-respond-to-us-attacks-trump-hints-at-regime-change

Russia claimed on Sunday that its forces had reached the border of Ukraine's Dnipropetrovsk region

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20250608-russia-says-pushing-offensive-into-ukraine-s-dnipropetrovsk-region

President Biden claimed former President Trump was "exaggerating" and "lying" about the crisis at the southern border during the first presidential debate.

https://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/watch/biden-claims-trump-is-exaggerating-about-the-situation-at-the-border-213854789562


They report on Russia and Iran's claims exactly the same way they report on anyone else's claims.