this post was submitted on 31 Jul 2025
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well i mean...you can't stop a war in another country by voting for it on some website.
Kony 2012
What a shitshow that turned out to be...
To think an evil African warlord was allowed to get away with it because of some silly laws against public masturbation or indecent exposure or whatever.
Did he ever get elected after all that?
At least we got a catchy song
Obligatory Internet Historian video
Russia's war on Ukraine shows you can't stop a war in another country even with massive sanctions.
And, various empires' adventures in Afghanistan show that even sending in troops to stop the "bad guys" will probably not work.
Sometimes people can make a change. The Apartheid governments of South Africa collapsed largely due to boycotts and people pressure. But, that only really works when the targeted country wants to be part of the community of nations, and its people don't want to be seen as criminals by the rest of the world. IMO, that situation is rare. Most of the time the rest of the world can't do much of anything when it comes to civil wars and border conflicts.
Not really. It is because Russia has nukes.
Key example of why having Nukes is important. You become Gaza if you don't have them.
So, Israel has nukes and Russia has nukes, and now these countries can do whatever they want. I'm not sure you have such a great point.
Israel cannot do anything by itself. It relies fully on Western funding and will collapse the moment they are sanctioned.
AFAIK, Israel is actually extremely prosperous these days, and the money received by the west is just "nice to have" free money these days.
If Ukraine had nukes...
"If you cross the line and use nukes, we will respond with our arsenal"
Kargil war
China v USSR
Cold war
At this point, it would be the better fate.
You can make your government join the war to stop the war
Just like you will never lose your virginity by talking to a horny chatbot.
Won't lose my house either
Not losing it either way. Even if you do everything right, sometimes you are just cursed.
So it's fine to have nothing.
True, but oddly you can contribute to wars by being American and paying taxes.
I don't think being a basic working human of certain nationality makes you a war contributor or anything else.
Well it's true even if you don't like knowing it.
People feel so disempowered, don't they? Yup. We tax payers directly fund genocide, and we should be fucking mad about it. We're fighting a religious war, being manipulated by intelligence agencies and evangelicals. It's bullshit, and rolling over is pathetic.
All you're doing is attempting to dehumanize and discredit people based on nationality. Literal MAGA mentality. No shit we pay taxes, do you not?
I'm doing neither. This is a fucking fact. Our, yes our, tax dollars are killing people. I'm sorry you live in some delusion that thinks this isn't true. You trying to reject truth and deny responsibility is the MAGA move here. Deal with it.
We all realize that. You implying all Americans are implicit because they're forced to pay taxes, like just about any citizen of any nation, is the stupid part here. Paying taxes does not make you implicit in the actions of your government. Full stop. Yet you keep bringing it up as a "gotcha".
"Hehe we're just as much to blame for being Americans even though we have a rigged election system and no way to escape it."
You have a lot of faith in what people in this country realize while also "full stopping" the responsibility that we are funding genocide. You think that because taxes are required to be paid that that somehow removes the responsibility from the tax payer, but that's just a cop out. If ANYONE in this country really gave a flying shit about fixing anything that is wrong then everyday would be a protest. People would give up their comforts and stop buying shit. People would quit going to their jobs. People would stop paying their taxes. We won't though. We're ok with the far away genocide because we can hop on social media and be like #stopgenocide so that EVERYONE knows we're good guys. It's all performance and you prove that with your argument. "I'm not causing genocide!!!" - You
I'm literally not causing a genocide, the IDF and ICE are lol. Me being against said genocides does not determine whether they happen. If either of us just happened to be born in another country their actions would likely remain the same and the genocides would have happened anyway. You're delusionally blaming all citizens for the actions of their governments. Get mad at the oligarchs, hell even the conservative voters, that is where the blame lies, not Timmy who just happened to be born in the US.
If this was about Russia, lots of people would be disagreeing with you. Especially like 3 years ago
Not voluntarily.
I didn't say it was voluntary.
they hated that 🤣
Yeah, because it's a really fucking stupid point to make. I didn't choose to be born in America and I'm forced to pay taxes. It's blaming every day citizens for their government's actions regardless of the citizen's actions or votes.
The majority of Lemmy is leftist, and the majority of Americans on Lemmy do not support what's happening right now. Should I blame you for the actions of your country? I'm sure we can find some awful shit if we look through history, especially if you're European.
I'm also American. yes we are to blame for the actions of our country because our country was founded on the principle that we would get a say in what it does no matter what. We even have a hierarchy of rights to protect our ability to take responsibility for our country's actions. From our right to free speech that protects our ability to protest, to our right to vote which protects our right to choose (in theory when we prevent vote fixing like gerrymandering ), to our right to own guns which allows us to protect the first two rights (when we don't let anyone limit 2a), to our right to be educated enough to exercise all the previous rights.
When things have gone as wrong as they have, sure there are bad actors involved but at some point we fucked up and that's on us. There will always be bad actors and we gotta be more responsible than just letting it go saying "well I didn't have a choice ". Our failures affect the whole world.
Eh, there are some pretty good arguments against that being the case, but even if it were, that principle hasn't really been in effect since before most of the people on Lemmy were even born.
I think it's fair to say we're responsible for improving the system if we don't like the way it currently works. But I don't think it's fair to say we're responsible for the actions of the system, if the system was stood up before we had any way to influence it.
My dude we severed ourselves from an empire over the literal phrase "no taxation without representation". that's what it means. and yeah, back then we only meant white people and now we only mean people with money but the tools to effect change are right here. we built them into our national identity. if you really don't see it, I encourage you to look harder. seek communities of like-minded potential voters or capital stormers.
we're all connected and effect the system we live in small ways that add up. you may disavow your contribution but that in itself is a decision that effects everything. our parents pretending otherwise is why it got like this. us continuing to do so is causing the next genocide.
My dude you can't just gloss over the "we only meant white people" bit in an effort to support your claim that the system was set up to accept everyone's input from the beginning lmao.
Feel how you wanna feel, but you won't make me feel guilty for the outcomes of a system I had no hand in setting up.
Look if we benefit from living in this country, which we do don't be ignorant, then we also have a responsibility to help make the world less shitty using whichever priveledges we can.
don't pretend what I'm doing here is trying to make you feel bad, you obviously feel too bad to even try anything except looking out for you. what I'm trying to do here is make someone reading this give a fuck. hopefully they will care more about our home than you do.
I agree that we have a responsibility to improve things, I've said that multiple times now. Are you even reading my replies? If you were, you wouldn't be putting all those words in my mouth. You're literally making shit up to create an adversary to argue against at this point.
look, I'm not a quote text guy. if you can't keep track of which of your statements I'm replying to, sure maybe I'm speaking Greek or having a seperate imaginary argument. But also it's possible that you were just the wrong person for me to attempt responding to. Some people can't introspect and need to make excuses for every thing they said that might have sounded weak and childish. it's fine, maybe I'll remember that next time somebody paragraph-replies to a three word observation I make literally about taking responsibility
The fuck are you talking about? My first interaction with you was a reply to your several-sentence-long, multi-paragraph comment, not a "three word observation". Are you ok?
okay that's where I'm calling it. your memory issues or inability to scroll up this emberassing ass thread aren't my problem. feel free to continue this conversation in your vapid fucking vacuum but I won't be receiving the notifications.
Lmao tells me to scroll up and blocks me because they can't read the username on replies, how embarrassing