this post was submitted on 14 Jun 2025
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[–] pm_me_weird_thoughts@lemm.ee 19 points 12 hours ago

Germany is, after U.S, the most pro Israel country of all countries

[–] tresspass@lemmy.world 16 points 12 hours ago

I'd find Germany less responsible for WWIII if maybe they ya know didn't support a genocidal terrorist ethnostate at the expense of domestically suppressing speech calling out that foreign policy, but I guess it just be like that sometimes

[–] febra@lemmy.world 28 points 18 hours ago (5 children)

Except Germany keeps delivering weapons to Israel, gives them diplomatic and political coverage, and apparently even has planes in the air to support Israeli fighter jets in their attacks on Iran.

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[–] MetalMachine@feddit.nl 27 points 21 hours ago

They are complicit in supporting and arming Israel as well as supporting the genocide.

[–] mathemachristian@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 19 hours ago

https://xcancel.com/josemendes2/status/1934190961719972153#m

Except we are once again fighting on the side of genocide.

[–] benjaminb@discuss.tchncs.de 11 points 20 hours ago (2 children)

Germans when they realise WW2 was caused by an man from Austria

Germans when they realise WW1 was caused by the assassination of the archduke of Austria and the subsequent declaration of war from Austria-Hungary on Serbia.

You could say Austria is responsible, but Hitler was in Germany, so WW2 is kinda our problem…

[–] hungryphrog@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 11 hours ago

Well, for now, I haven't seen Austria do anything to start WWIII

[–] Uranus_Hz@lemm.ee 2 points 12 hours ago

Also, the State of Israel was created right after, and as a direct response, to WWII.

[–] NichEherVielleicht@feddit.org 112 points 1 day ago
[–] Wispy2891@lemmy.world 11 points 22 hours ago

Well if they didn't genocide all those millions of innocent Jews 80 years ago, western countries wouldn't accept the invasion and genocide in Palestine over the last decades

[–] DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 20 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Israel: we wouldn't have started it without Germany's security guarantees!

[–] LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.world 4 points 21 hours ago

They also might not be a zionist county. Hard to say what things would look like now if dumbassery 1 & 2 hadn't occurred.

[–] kerrigan778@lemmy.blahaj.zone 43 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (8 children)

Germany is the second largest provider of weapons to Israel, and a huge longtime consumer of Russian gas, this is a tonedeaf as hell meme.

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[–] Moonweedbaddegrasse@lemmy.world 156 points 1 day ago (9 children)

Wellllll... If it hadn't been for Germany, Israel probably wouldn't exist.....

[–] shiroininja@lemmy.world 69 points 1 day ago (1 children)
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[–] wpb@lemmy.world 45 points 1 day ago (11 children)

They're highly complicit in Israel's actions.

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[–] WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 3 points 18 hours ago

Serbia when we realize we are not responsible for WW3:

[–] LordWiggle@lemmy.world 80 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Germany is Europe's biggest supporter of Israel.

The biggest issue is that we, the EU, are on the side of Germany now. And their track record with world wars isn't great.

[–] thebestaquaman@lemmy.world 38 points 1 day ago (18 children)

To be fair to the Germans, I can understand how the Holocaust is integrated into them as a kind of "original sin". What was done to the Jews under the Nazis was so unspeakable terrible, and German society as a whole has done an enormous job at ingraining in themselves that nothing of the sort should ever repeat itself.

The problem is that "nothing of the sort" has translated into "opposing Jews in any way". It seems to me like Germany sees itself as bound to support Jews (and thereby the Jewish state Israel) no matter what in order to "atone for their sins", and I can understand that. However, right now, Israel is suddenly the state committing the closest thing we've seen to the Holocaust since the actual Holocaust. It's very hard for Germany to oppose Israel without tickling a part of their history that they've done a laudable job at condemning.

What Germany needs now, is to separate their history from their current politics. I understand that it's difficult, and I don't have an answer to how it should be done, but it needs to happen, lest the same crimes are committed again.

To be fair to the Germans, I can understand how the Holocaust is integrated into them as a kind of “original sin”. What was done to the Jews under the Nazis was so unspeakable terrible, and German society as a whole has done an enormous job at ingraining in themselves that nothing of the sort should ever repeat itself.

The problem with Germany is that they learned the wrong lesson out of WW2.

Instead of learning "genocide is bad", it's "Jews are always on the right side of history". And that's why Germany is completely uncritically supporting Israel with everything that it does.

[–] p3n@lemmy.world 20 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Israel is suddenly the state committing the closest thing we’ve seen to the Holocaust since the actual Holocaust.

I don't say this to excuse anything Israel is doing, but this is gross recency bias that is glossing over numerous genocides that have occurred since the Holocaust, including:

Not technically genocides, but also worth mentioning in the same vein:

So ya, other than those events, this is the closest thing to the Holocaust since the actual Holocaust.

[–] thebestaquaman@lemmy.world 6 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

It's laudable of you to bring attention to these other atrocities. Without creating a "race to the bottom" regarding what was worse, I still want to point out that the horror of the Holocaust was not only in the number of killed.

I'm aware of a couple of the atrocities you mentioned, but as far as I'm aware, they don't carry the clinical state-sponsored efficiency that is a hallmark of the Holocaust. When I compare Gaza today to the holocaust, that's what I'm comparing, rather than the number of killed. It's about the way Isreal has decided to wipe out the population of Gaza, and systematically does so completely unhindered.

[–] p3n@lemmy.world 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

To be clear, aside from the part I quoted, I agreed with everything else in your post and thought it was an interesting take, but again I have to take issue with this:

as far as I’m aware, they don’t carry the clinical state-sponsored efficiency that is a hallmark of the Holocaust.

I'm not going to analyze every single atrocity since 1945, but the Cambodian genocide was certainly state-sponsored, efficient, and horrific:

"20,000 people passed through the Security Prison 21, one of the 196 prisons the Khmer Rouge operated,[4][28] and only seven adults survived.[29]"

"The executed were buried in mass graves. In order to save ammunition, the executions were often carried out using poison or improvised weapons such as sharpened bamboo sticks, hammers, machetes and axes.[6] ... In some cases the children and infants of adult victims were killed by having their heads bashed against the trunks of Chankiri trees, and then were thrown into the pits alongside their parents. The rationale was "to stop them growing up and taking revenge for their parents' deaths."

"People were imprisoned and tortured merely on suspicion of opposing the regime or because other prisoners gave their names under torture. Whole families (including women and children) ended up in prisons and were tortured because the Khmer Rouge feared that if they did not do this, their intended victims' relatives would seek revenge. Pol Pot said, "if you want to kill the grass, you also have to kill the roots".[169]"

"There are many accounts of torture in both the Security Prison 21 records and the documents of the trial; as told by the survivor Bou Meng in his book (written by Huy Vannak), tortures were so atrocious and heinous that the prisoners tried in every way to commit suicide, even using spoons, and their hands were constantly tied behind their back to prevent them from committing suicide "

"all medical experiments were systematically conducted without proper anesthetics.[173] A medic who worked inside S-21 said that a 17-year-old girl had her throat slit and her abdomen pierced before being beaten and put into water for an entire night. This procedure was repeated many times and carried out without anesthetics.[174] In a hospital of Kampong Cham province, child medics cut out the intestines of a living non-consenting person and joined their ends to study the healing process. The patient died after three days due to the "operation".[173]"

"Twenty-six-year-old John D. Dewhirst, a British tourist, was one of the youngest foreigners to die in the prison.[17] He was sailing with his New Zealand companion, Kerry Hamill, and their Canadian friend Stuart Glass when their boat drifted into Cambodian territory and was intercepted by Khmer patrol boats on August 13, 1978. Glass was killed during the arrest, while Dewhirst and Hamill were captured, blindfolded, and taken to shore. Both were executed after having been tortured for several months at Tuol Sleng. Witnesses reported that a foreigner was burned alive; initially, it was suggested that this might have been John Dewhirst, but a survivor would later identify Kerry Hamill as the victim of this particular act of brutality."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambodian_genocide

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuol_Sleng_Genocide_Museum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_Fields

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[–] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 109 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)
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[–] xiwi@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 19 hours ago (2 children)

They have a big share in the current state of affairs, whether it is the genocide of the Palestinian people or the complete failure of Europe. the German state hasn't changed a fucking bit

[–] Foofighter@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 12 hours ago

I think Germany stopped invading Poland and killing Jews in gas chambers. So I'd say Germany changed at least a little bit.

[–] petersr@lemmy.world 6 points 18 hours ago (1 children)

What is meant by "complete failure of Europe"?

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