Socialism_Everyday

I think the genocide of Gazans intensified in 2023, but no, I think it's been ongoing for almost a century at this point. Why?

Millions of innocents were murdered regardless, I don't see your point.

I commend your care about the minorities in the US, I'm just trying to show that this isn't an exclusive Trump issue, the US system literally puts 1 in 5 black men through the prison system throughout their lives. I'm not endorsing Trump, I'm not endorsing ICE, both are fascist organizations. It's just that the entire US apparatus is fascist and now it's strengthening its repression inwards, which has USians worried. As a non-USian, it's sad to see, but it's what Democrats enabled by not doing literally anything during their rule and putting forth an unelectable pro-genocide candidate talking of fascist points such as the infamous "I will ensure that the USA has the most lethal armed forces in the world" to which the crowd in the DNC responded "USA, USA, USA". The way to fight fascists historically isn't to elect less fascist right wing, not even social democrats, but to organize in communist and anarchist unions, parties and organizations.

I would agree depending on the control of media. People only woke up to the genocide in Palestine due to the widespread usage of a non-US-controlled social media: tiktok. As the US moves in its efforts to ban or purchase alternative media (also including ban of Russian media in the EU), they will possibly be able to control the narrative, yet to be seen. For now, all US citizens are convinced that Maduro is an unpopular criminal dictator and have no idea of the effect of US sanctions on Venezuelan economy and the desperate suffering that they're causing, and are therefore primed to accept an invasion.

Quick google search:

You can bring isolated instances as much as you want, macro data points to this being a bipartisan issue and nothing having fundamentally changed.

This is not an endorsement of Trump, this is a blanket condemnation of the entire US government apparatus, which should be entirely dissolved.

How did the "democracy" prevent all the Cold War shit? Millions of murdered in Vietnam, Korea, Laos, Cambodia, Cuba, Chile, Brazil, Argentina, Iraq... US warmongering is bipartisan and kills millions regardless

The Russian Ministry of Defense admits 307,000 children were illegally forced from their homes in Ukraine and relocated to Russia

Those numbers are ridiculous and blatant Russian propaganda. Taking the Russian Ministry of Defense claims at face value is absurd, and if I'm not mistaken this isn't even an official communiqué but just something a higher up of the organization said. Unless you truly believe that Russia had killed 1mn Ukrainian soldiers by 2023, you shouldn't believe the number of kidnapped children claim.

What ratio of soldier to civilian casualties is necessary for a genocide?

There isn't a final answer but obviously extreme numbers on one either of the ratio are relevant (i.e. 600k Palestinian civilians murdered by "Israel" since Oct 2023 with about half of them being children out of a population of a few million people in Gaza point towards genocide, the case for Ukraine doesn't point to that direction with estimates not usually exceeding the 20k civilians dead since Feb 2022, with military deaths probably above a few hundreds of thousands).

It's not just about the children, the areas being conquered are having their culture and history stripped away and destroyed, the language is being changed to Russian

Since 2014 the Ukrainian government was shelling Donbas during the Ukrainian civil war, and in some regions with a majority of self-defined Russians Russian was forbidden. Russia argues that this was a genocide of Russians through war and erasure of language and Russian culture with Russian icons being demolished too. Genocide of Russians is the justification of Russia to invade Ukraine. I don't take these accusations of genocide that seriously either because of the same reasons I don't believe Russia is genociding Ukrainians, I believe it's a political tool to turn your population against a geopolitical enemy. That's why I want to base this discussion on independent journalistic work instead of accusations from one government to the other

You have more police violence in the US, not more genocide. There is no genocide in the US going on unless you count 20% of black males going to prison at some point in their lives, which is happening since many administrations ago and hasn't really changed that much since Trump. You had the highest number of deportations during Obama, didn't you?

Not everything we dislike about the US political system is genocide, I want to abolish the USA to be clear, but again: the fault of dems not being elected is Democratic elites who refuse to bring anything remotely palatable to the table. It was not "sabotage" that ruined the Dems chances of winning unless by sabotage you mean the internal one destroying every progressive candidate.

I didn't choose shit and I didn't sabotage shit, I'm a Spaniard in Spain without desire or right to vote in your country, that's why it's flagrantly obvious to me that choosing the least appealing possible candidate will result in elections being lost.

Leftists couldn't have voted for Kamala because they didn't vote for Kamala, it is the dems who lost the elections lmao

A fascist America means cold war era coup attempts in Latin countries are back

I mean, it's not like Milei, Bolsonaro or the Nobel Prize laureate aren't heavily supported by the US. "Cold war coups" never really stopped in Latin American countries

The difference of dem voters between last and previous elections is surely higher than that.

Comparing the ratio of civilian/children to soldier casualties of the Ukraine war with essentially any other war in which an industrialized nation has engaged in for the past half a century it gets obvious that Russia's objective is not the elimination of Ukrainians as an ethnicity unless we apply that standard for US involvement in Iraq, Vietnam, Afghanistan... (which I consider atrocious but not genocidal). It is a war of invasion, but not a genocide.

Ukrainian children being kidnapped are isolated instances, not a mass occurrence, no serious journalistic job proves otherwise other than claims from the Ukrainian administration, which has obvious reasons for doing atrocity propaganda.

These accusations of children/women being hurt are levied in every western involvement as we saw with Nayirah's Testimony which the west took at face value and turned out to be a psyop to sway public opinion doing atrocity propaganda against Iraq.

I'm in favour of condemning all instances of Ukrainian children being relocated to Russia and I'd arguably consider most of those a war crime, but there's a step between that and taking Ukrainian administration claims of tens of thousands (when the independently confirmed numbers hover the hundreds or few thousands if I'm not mistaken) and making accusations of genocide.

Using the word "genocide" lightly to describe every western geopolitical enemy is dangerous towards victims of blatant genocide such as Palestinians, at risk of losing the weight of the war.

I believe some people can be convinced and some can't. I don't think I'm going to convince a random lemmitor arguing for the mass forcible relocation of Palestinian children, I can engage in more nuanced discussion with people who truly don't understand but care about the topic