this post was submitted on 15 Apr 2025
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Perfectly true.
But anarchism hasn't exactly been very productive over the last century when it comes to providing alternatives, has it?
Anarchism has been very productive in improving the lives of those who practice it. Bringing about things like the 40-hour week. Anarchism doesn't have to become the sociopolitical system to be beneficial. Look into prefiguration and also look at the comm rules.
Can you show me anywhere in the world where anarchism is as strongly represented in labor movements as it was in Spain during the 1930s?
Looking at the past does not make the present any better.
So what should it be then? A vanguard in everything but name?
I'd love to... but where is it? Every time I ask anarchists this, they point me to social projects such as that happening in northern Syria and Chiappas in Mexico - social projects that reject the anarchist label. And I don't exactly blame them for rejecting it, either - trying to "preconfigure" something when your theory is too damn orthodox to even allow you to understand what "preconfiguring" should actually look like is a pretty obvious sociopolitical dead-end.
Can you show me anywhere in the world where Liberal Capitalist Democracy was strongly represented in 1400s? See how absurd this statement is?
The opposite. Improving the lives of people practicing it in the here and now through anarchist praxis. People can practice direct action for mutual aid right now.
Prefiguration is a theory of praxis
Liberalism is literally the ideology of the status quo now.
Is it absurd to point that out, too?
Soooo... the failure of anarchism to actually preconfigure anything since the end of WW2 in the face of massive liberal counter-insurgency is perhaps tied to anarchist's theories about preconfiguration not being remotely good enough - if they even exist at all?
What's absurd is to claim that a radical socioeconomic reconfiguration can't happen because it hasn't happened yet.
Anarchist prefigure things all the time. Mutual Banks, Cooperatives, Anarcho-syndicalist unions, food banks, soup kitchens and so much more. Don't know what the fuck you're on about.
Anarchists saved and improved countless lives in the last few years by doing direct action. They rescue(d) and support(ed) refugees, fed people all over the world, setup bail funds and so much more.
Actually impacting other peoples lives (and your oen) directly is a pretty appealing alternative imo.
This is all great - but lots of organizations and movements are doing direct action of all kinds. Can you seriously tell me that this represents a functional political movement that would be capable of surviving and thriving if a convulsive revolution were to kick off tomorrow?
what a shitty and irrelevant argument
Who said anything about anarchism? I'd be happy to just get democracy back.
When did we have democracy?
Depends on you threshold but we have had it for a while. No need to spend money on elections or news media if we didn't have a democracy.
Getting to "choose" which pack of political racketeers gets to be the public face of capitalist looting and pillaging falls outside my threshold... which means that we've never had anything that can be called "democracy" with a straight face.
If we accept the liberals' definition of democracy we might just as well accept the tankie's definition of socialism, too - both are equally warped and vile.
Ok then, using your metrics we never had democracy. Using my metrics we had democracy, and I would prefer that to fascism.
But I also like stronger democracy. So if we can make improvements I'm all for it.
If I were (as a thought exercise) to consider your metrics for democracy valid, I'd have to enquire as to what the point of democracy even is if it comes with fascism as a built-in feature - which, of course, is perfectly acceptable if we were to use your metrics.
And that's before we even get into the nitty gritty of how your metrics of democracy solves the fundamentally violent and fundamentally irreconcilable incompatibility between democratic values and the capitalist mode of production.
Why are you mad at me? All I am saying is what we have right now is worse than what we had last year and I would like that back at the very least. I never said that what we had a year ago would solve all the problems or was the ideal government or the best form of democracy.
Ummm... I'm not mad at you.
I'm trying to show you that you aren't asking to get democracy back (because that's something you never had).
What you are asking for is to have the "good cop" back - the very "good cop" that is right now busy handing you over to the bad one.
So we are just arguing over the definition of Democracy? I think we have to agree to disagree here. I don't think I care enough to have a deep discussion with you about that.
You don't care to find out if the thing you have been calling "democracy" your entire life even qualifies as democratic?
Fair enough, I guess - maybe the people calling themselves "democrats" not lifting a finger to stop fascism hasn't convinced you to question the lies these very same people have been selling you since birth... but that could never be me.
Yeah, I definitely don't care enough to discuss it with you. Have you read what you have posted? You sound like the least reasonable person to discuss this with. You aren't even engaging with what I have posted, you are just activated by the fact that my definition isn't exactly your definition. Go argue about nothing with someone who cares, I am not into this kink.
If all you want is to have the "good" cop to come back, and to be subject to the carrot instead of the stick - fine. You do you.
But is it too much to ask for you to simply be honest about it?
What are you talking about? Literally this whole thread started with me pointing out. It's worse now than it was last year. I never said it was the best situation last year. What do you mean talking about Good cop? I have been honest.
You do realize that calling what we had before Trumps second term a democracy does not mean that. I think it's the best right?