this post was submitted on 14 May 2025
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[–] ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 1 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago) (1 children)

It is more about the fact that when the buyer is committing a criminal act, they can be prosecuted for that criminal act.

It also is assumed that the sex worker will not be interested in helping. It is on the judicial system to find the criminals and prosecute them.

The sex worker is doing something entirely legal. It's up to the system to protect their right to do that while also protecting them from predation. That's the thought, anyway.

[–] thanksforallthefish@literature.cafe 7 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

The sex worker is doing something entirely legal. It's up to the system to protect their right to do that while also protecting them from predation. That's the thought, anyway.

Respectfully no it's not.

The thought is to ensure that culpability sits with the buyer and not the seller. By criminalising the buyer the thinking is that the poor victim forced into sex work should not receive any punishment. Which is fine if the person was forced into it/trafficked but it's not OK if the person chose to do it of their own free will.

The Swedish model is at its heart paternalistic - it denies people the right to choose to do sex work because the state doesn't believe a person is capable of making that choice, they can only be coerced into it.

[–] ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 5 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago) (1 children)

I have had to clarify this a couple of times now in this thread but what I wrote is not my personal stance. It is what the stated intention is. That doesn't make it right or effective.

All my my comment was intended to do, was to add context to a discussion about a society that I live in. I did not intend to put my personal stamp of approval on the consequences of that societal context.

I do personally believe that, assuming the stated intention is true, the law hasn't done what was meant to be achieved perfectly and that it should be discussed whether there is something that can be done to better the situation.

We have a few moralistic laws in Sweden that at the very least need more debate. The laws around sex work are definitely on that list imo.

[–] thanksforallthefish@literature.cafe 1 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

I have had to clarify this a couple of times now in this thread but what I wrote is not my personal stance. It is what the stated intention is. That doesn't make it right or effective.

As per my other reply, that was understood.

I do personally believe that, assuming the stated intention is true, the law hasn't done what was meant to be achieved perfectly and that it should be discussed whether there is something that can be done to better the situation.

Again, as per other (long) reply, the big problem is the "intention" you are portraying is not actually consistent with both the speeches made when the original laws were passed and any reasonable reading of the law.

The intention is to abolish sex work because in the minds of the framers it is not possible for an adult to consent to it.

I'm not upset with you for trying to improve understanding. I'd however implore you to consider how taking agency away from people, telling them they are not capable of making a decision about themselves and their body is morally and ethically flawed.

The justification about it stopping trafficking has not held up to analysis, criminals continue to do crime. It's guys like the one in the article and other men & women who pay the price for someone to have a righteous middle class glow.

Strong social welfare systems (like Sweden has) help prevent people doing it from desperation - so buttress those if there's a shortcoming. Strong regulation of migration prevents trafficking before we even get to regulating the industry. Those are things that peer reviewed papers have shown to work.

[–] ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 4 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

You do keep saying that you understand but you also implore me to consider how taking agency away from people, telling them they are not capable of making a decision about themselves and their body is morally and ethically flawed.

Something which I've never said that I personally haven't. So I think we're closer in personal belief on the issue than we maybe assume we are.