greedy zionist filth dont desevre more money. geneciders desevre to be culled, death to the idf and isreal. filthy nazi scum
this post was submitted on 28 Jun 2025
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This is the type of shit that leads to pogroms and lies like “The Elders of Zion.”
Benefits Netanyahu short term. Hurts Jews long term.
Israel has gone out of its way to eliminate sympathy towards Jewish survivors of the holocaust.
But they say Israel has no right to exist at all now
This gets a little philosophical, but do nations have some specific right to exist? People certainly do have a right to exist, but I just don't see this applying to a governmental entity. We hear about human rights, but not nation rights. And if we are going to apply it to nations, then the next question is: does Palestine have a right to exist?
How many nations in other parts of the world have been "eaten" by imperialism? Does Hawaii have the right to exist as its own separate nation? Where's the outcry for them?
Nation-states are the problem. They're based on the belief that everyone with some common set of features (language, religion, etc) are somehow a uniform, undifferentiated whole, and anyone who doesn't fit the template are to be excluded and disempowered. So you end up with an in-group either attemptiong to force-assimilate or exterminate everyone else. For example, the way the Castilians treat the Catalans, Basques, Galicians and others in Spain, or the way the Danes treat the Greenlanders, or the way the Han Chinese treat anyone who isn't Han, or the way the Turks treated their Greek minority (now ethnically cleansed), their Kurdish minority (culturally suppressed and occasionally attacked), their former Armenian minority (subjected to genocide), etc, etc.
And they're most damaging in cases where mutiple ethnicities live alongside each others-- for example, the Serbs' attempts to subjugate minorities under their control.
There are few exceptions to this: one being Scotland, which generally constructs its national identity in an inclusive way.
As for Israel, do your own analysis.
It seems you’re conflating the words nation and state. A nation is a group of people with a shared, named identity, such as Hawaiian or Palestinian. A state is an officially recognized group with sovereignty over an area of land. Many nations exist which do not have their own states.
All nations have the right to exist by the human right to freedom of association. Sovereign states have no right to exist: their existence is asserted and defended by force and by mutual recognition with other sovereign states.
The word nation has come to mean nation-state. Borders changing does not equate people changing anymore.
A nation is a group of people with a shared, named identity, such as Hawaiian or Palestinian
Hmm, I dont think this is true in the most common usage, but it's also not what is meant when people challenge the notion of Israel's 'right to exist'.
Nobody contends that the "shared identity" of Israel has no right to exist, only that Israel as a capital-J Jewish State has no unique or exclusive right to self-determination in Historic Palestine. No state or nationality has a right to deny the self-determination of another group on the basis of ethnic identity.
Nobody contends that the "shared identity" of Israel has no right to exist
That’s where things get tricky. There clearly are people who claim Israel (and Jews in general) as a shared identity and cultural group have no right to exist. These people are traditionally called Nazis.
You’ll also run into trouble talking about historic Palestine, previously part of the Ottoman Empire, and long prior to that the Kingdom of Israel (around 1047-930 BCE). The Israelis aren’t simply a group of Ashkenazi Jews who moved to the Middle East during the Holocaust. They’re a people who have lived in the area for thousands of years and maintained a distinct culture throughout occupation by other empires.
They’re a people who have lived in the area for thousands of years and maintained a distinct culture throughout occupation by other empires.
No, these people are called Palestinians, not Israelis.
If you’re just going to lie then you’re not even worth talking to.
Where's the lie? Have Palestinians not lived in the area for thousands of years or maintained a distinct culture, even while being occupied by other empires?
Israelis and Palestinians have lived in the area for centuries and centuries. They’re ethnically the same, brothers and sisters. They differ by culture and the old problem (familiarity breeds contempt). I have maintained all along that both have a right to exist and to self-determination.
But there are people here that now deny these rights to Israelis simply because Israel has a lot of military and political power right now. It’s like for them it’s not enough for Palestine to be free, they must also see Israel destroyed. And in the process they overlook the atrocities committed by Hamas (not to mention what the PLO did in Jordan decades ago).
Again, where was the lie?
They’re ethnically the same, brothers and sisters
Not according to the state of Israel
The lie was that only Palestinians have lived there for thousands of years.
Not according to the state of Israel
Correction: the government of Israel, with a ruling party (Likud, led by Bibi) which has 32/120 seats in the Knesset. That’s less than 27% of the seats. This is what you get with proportional representation and coalition government.
The lie was that only Palestinians have lived there for thousands of years.
- that isn't what they said
- i believe it was tongue-in-cheek
Correction: the government of Israel
Israel (the state) has always given special rights to ethnic Jews. It was founded *as an explicitly Jewish state. Jews have always been given a unique right to freely immigrate and gain citizenship, while limiting Palestinian's right to even return to their homes in Israel after having to flee. It isn't just about the current government - Israel has always been predicated on an ethno-religious immigration campaign. No other nation on the planet is as singularly-focused on the ethnic makeup of its population, to the point that they have an actual program to retrieve the reproductive material of soldiers who die in combat. Zionists will waste no time calling you antisemitic if you were to suggest that Israel should provide equal rights regardless of ethnic or religious identity, or suggest that Palestinians and Jews might live together on their shared ancestral land. It's that idea that Palestinians are so violent that they'd just "destroy all the Jews" if they were to ever be given equal status that is the wildly bigoted and racist one.
This isn't some transient political movement unique to Netanyahu's government, it's been a principle feature of its mission since it's founding.
previously part of the Ottoman Empire, and long prior to that the Kingdom of Israel (around 1047-930 BCE)
Yeah, if you look far enough back in history, nobody had autonomy or freedom, and amost everyone was subject to imperial tyranny of some kind. So what?
One thing that's very clear is that things said in the Bible don't entitle anyone to take someone else's home. It's a holy book, not a title document.
They’re a people who have lived in the area for thousands of years
A small number did. Vastly more were part of the diaspora.
I'm part of the Anglo-Saxon diaspora. That doesn't mean I can go to Dresden and kick some family out of their house because my ancestors lived in that area over a millennium ago. Such a claim would be seen as manifestly idiotic. And if it were two millennia, such a claim would be even more absurd.
All our ancestors originated in Africa, shall we use that as an excuse to displace some modern African people?
A small number did. Vastly more were part of the diaspora.
That’s not true. Only 26% (and shrinking) of Israeli Jews have European ancestry. A plurality, 44% (and the fastest growing) have native Israeli ancestry. The remainder come from North Africa and Asian ancestry but all groups besides Israeli background are shrinking.
The study you're referencing is looking at paternal lineage of Israelis born in Israel, not the ancestral lineage of all Israelis.
A second-generation Israeli would be considered 'From Israel by paternal country of origin" in this census, because their paternal country of origin would be Israel.
The bulk of immigration happened in the 1950's-1970's. The number of Israeli's who's ancestors lived in Israel before the establishment of the Israeli state isn't ~~a known or studied figure~~ a definitively answered question, but it's reasonable to assume that it's a minority given the large migrations that happened during and after the Nakba.
The only real information we have regarding the make-up of Palestine before its partitioning are a couple of censuses done during the British occupation, but it was during a period of time when zionist jews were already beginning to migrate. Here's the topline:
The census found a total population of 1,035,821 (1,033,314 excluding the numbers of H.M. Forces),[2] an increase of 36.8% since 1922, of which the Jewish population increased by 108.4%.[1]
The population was divided by religion as follows: 759,717 Muslims, 174,610 Jews, 91,398 Christians, 9,148 Druzes, 350 Bahais, 182 Samaritans, and 421 reporting no religion.[3] A special problem was posed by the nomadic Bedouin of the south, who were reluctant to co-operate. Estimates of each tribe were made by officers of the district administration according to local observation. The total of 759,717 Muslims included 66,553 persons enumerated by that method.[4] The number of foreign British forces stationed in Palestine in 1931 totalled 2,500.[5]
There clearly are people who claim Israel (and Jews in general) as a shared identity and cultural group have no right to exist. These people are traditionally called Nazis.
Yup, and those Nazis largely supported the Zionist mission of a Jewish state, both because they wanted the Jews to emigrate out of Europe and because they hated Arabs almost as much as they hated Jews. Nazis and Zionists share a strictly defined understanding of cultural and ethnic boundaries, and a belief that geographical boundaries are a reflection of those boundaries (or ought to). It's only really tricky if your understanding of Zionism and Israel is limited to the specific group that is doing the cleansing.
The Israelis aren’t simply a group of Ashkenazi Jews who moved to the Middle East during the Holocaust. They’re a people who have lived in the area for thousands of years and maintained a distinct culture throughout occupation by other empires.
The jewish diaspora is almost as defined by their shared cultural heritage with their middle eastern neighbors as it is by their origin. You can't draw a clean ethnic or cultural boundary around Israel that's separate from their arabic brothers and sisters. That's exactly the problem with zionism - it attempts to forcefully separate the cultural inheritance of its arabic history and expel it from both the geographical and cultural boundaries of Israel.
People who oppose Israel as a Jewish state do so because they see Zionism as a mission of ethnic and cultural purification, not because it's a symbolic representation of Jews as an entire people. That's what makes the conflation of anti-zionism and antisemitism so nefarious.
Nazis during the Holocaust might have wanted Jews deported to Israel but today’s Nazis want Israel wiped off the map and all Jews destroyed.
You can't draw a clean ethnic or cultural boundary around Israel that's separate from their arabic brothers and sisters
Not an ethnic boundary but definitely a cultural one. Judaism is very different from Islam. Palestinian culture is very different from Israeli culture.
That's what makes the conflation of anti-zionism and antisemitism so nefarious.
The conflation happens on both sides of the argument. The two extremes need each other to justify themselves.
I believe both Israel and Palestine have a right to exist. The issue is that both claim the same land and neither tolerates the other at this point. It doesn’t help that none of Israel’s neighbours want Palestinian refugees so the crisis is exacerbated to such an extreme.
Judaism is very different from Islam.
Good thing the ME isn't mono-religious
Palestinian culture is very different from Israeli culture
Insofar as they are both partially defined by being on either side of an apartheid state, sure. But Jews and arabs lived very peacefully in Palestine and throughout the ME long before Palestine was partitioned. The ME was full of arab-jewish communities living alongside Muslims before Israel began their immigration campaign and before pan-arab nationalism spread through the region. I highly recommend Avi Shlaim's "Three World's" book if you're curious how those cultures developed alongside each other, and how they've changed since Israel's establishment.
I believe both Israel and Palestine have a right to exist.
I believe both the people of Palestine and Israel have a right to exist, but neither have a right to exist as ethno-nationalist apartheid states.
Notice it’s to protect Jewish organizations, not Jewish people.
Apparently it is now antisemitic to speak out against an organization you disagree with, even ones that bear a strong resemblance to what would otherwise be labeled a terrorist organization.
The problem of course is that there ARE antisemites out there mixed in with all the people upset with the US and Israeli governments.
Its antisemitic to not fund organizations that pay for settler terrorism in the west bank actually
No religious body should ever receive federal money for anything short of a natural disaster to repair their assets. Jews, Baptists, Muslims, Buddhists, etc... they're all the same in my eyes, and should be in the eyes of the government. They are all fucking loony toons that believe in ghosts, and that shit has no place in law and government. Let them fail for their beliefs or grow up and join and evolve with society.
Any state that does not guarantee equal rights for it's people should not exist. Hate has nothing to do with it.
Does MAGA like Jews? I was under the impression they supported Israel but hated Jews, because...MAGA.
They like a very particular kind of Jewish person the same way they like a very particular kind of Christian. That being hardcore conservatives who use religious doctrine as a cover for bigoted dog whistling and nothing more.
Sounds about right.
Now use that money to protest against ICE
Can I be Jewish now? I promise I'll get organized for that amount of money.
I didn't think it would cost that much to send them to Israel
Most Jews want to go to Israel about as much as most Anglo Saxons want to go to the US.
The largest group of people of Anglo-Saxon descent live in the US.
But a more correct analogy would be how many Anglo-Saxons want to recolonize Saxony.
I agree but I am of Anglo Bassoonon descent
Not everyone can be piccolo, Shirley….
They can try, but the name is not Shirley.
Secretary Kristi Noem and the Department of Homeland Security announced $94 million in federal grants to over 500 Jewish-based organizations across the United States.
Fuck Noem and her ICE bullshit.
I welcome this. Jewish Americans have been wrongfully threatened over things Israel has been doing. Jewish Americans (the many im friends with) hate the Israel govt's actions and leaned heavily Democrat. Temple were getting weekly bomb scares during 2024, and there's been lots of harassment and physical violence. They walked alongside of us during BLM and No Kings.
I wish this was extended to the Muslim community. But of course, we know why it's not.