A modest proposal: If a majority of 51,89% for and 48,11% against was enough to push through with Brexit, maybe 55% vs. 30% should also be a clear votum to start talking about a new EU membership.
this post was submitted on 01 Feb 2025
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The problem isnβt just re-joining the eu. New contracts would be formed that would be far less advantageous for Britain than they previously had. Which would start this whole circus again :(
This whole thing was so predictable even to high school me, it's ridiculous.
Iβm one of those morons who thought it was such a sure thing, weβd obviously stay that I was βtoo busyβ to vote. Nothing but regret
I fucking hate past you, but respect current you
I honestly think that's very wrong and one of the last brexiteer arguments that still seems to be believed by reasonable people.
Under the old terms, the UK was one of the largest net contributors to the EU. And also one of the countries absorbing the most immigrants. In fact, the exemptions they got were all quite reasonable.
Without the exemptions, the UK would have been an even bigger net contributor and would have had even more immigrants.
Just from pure self-interest, the EU would be foolish to demand more than the old terms. In fact, with smart negotiating, I am sure the UK could get even more exemptions than they used to have.
And we, the EU, know this. The war in Ukraine is expensive af. The UK is already helping above and beyond what we could expect from them. The EU economy isn't doing all too great either.
The mutual benefits of the UK rejoining will be billions if not trillions of extra economic output on both sides. It would be billions extra budget for the EU.
Why would we drive a hard bargain to squeeze out the Brits?
Friendly terms that make the British politicians look good and that make the UK public feel like winners and which provide direct short term economic benefits are the way to do it.
Unfortunately it is highly unlikely. The EU would not be being punitive in requiring the UK to play by the same rules as everyone else, it would be playing by its own rules and being fair.
They require countries to join the eurozone when ready and they require signing up to the common agricultural policy etc. Member states that did not get to opt out or rebates would not be willing to allow a new member to have those benefits and any country can veto a country joining. It could only be on the same terms as everyone else.
I dont see the UK rejoining for a generation. The Euro, the CAP and immigration remain highly toxic topics in the UK and would derail any attempt to rejoin.
Also leaving the EU has not been as harmful as we thought. Im not saying its been a positive thing but it hasn't been anywhere as disasterous was being made out on the remain side of the debate. A reduction in growth while the economy is still growing is not being felt by people. Covid also massively muddied the water - some of the side effects of leaving have been attributed in peoples minds to the pandemic instead.
And the biggest issues in the UK - public services and immigration - have little to nothing to do with the EU. So its just not part of the mainstream political discourse 9 years after the vote.
Without the exemptions, the UK would have been an even bigger net contributor and would have had even more immigrants.
When a new country joins the union there's always a grace period where countries can say "freedom of movement doesn't apply to them, yet". This is to avoid migration waves while still kinda poor countries catch up in terms of living standards which then reduces migration rates naturally.
The UK never made use of that. Westminster never used the mechanisms the EU gave them to control the flow of immigration. So, kindly, fuck off with your bollocks. This is precisely the kind of thing why the rest of the EU is apprehensive of the UK rejoining. The rest of Europe doesn't like to play scapegoat for Etonians.
Itβs funny how such a small amount of text can fill somebody with so much hope. Thank you stranger for bringing a little light :)
We're not strangers, we're Europeans.
In my small village of the Netherlands there are graves of RAF pilots. And in NATO, we are still allies.
My wife made scones and lemon curd this weekend.
My favourite heat pump geek (urban plumbers on youtube) is a Polish guy living and working in the UK.
All these attempts by people trying to divide Europeans are pathetic. It's sad that many people fall for it, because we share a culture and a history.
The UK rejoining the EU in some shape or form (perhaps the EEA) is just a matter of time. Same with Ukraine.
And personally, I think we should already start planning on how to form strategic defense and trade alliances with Turkey, Egypt and a post-Putin Russia. That will solidify a peaceful and prosperous 21st century in Europe and West-Asia.
Anything above their old terms would send a very bad signal to any EU members. There are arguments to be made anywhere between "same rules as new states" and "old rules all the way", but more than that means setting the EU up for other states to follow.
Still better than being alone
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...maybe the EU citizens should be asked first IF they want the brits to come back in the first place?
and if they do - under what conditions. Don't forget the fact the Brits really have burned-down the bridges and threw every little bit of bullshit at the EU and several of the coutries, including their leaders. So - if they want to come back, they should think about a way to redeem themselves.
It's not about redemption or something like that. EU membership is a process and open to all european countries. If UK wants to join again, we don't need an apology from the population.
(and, by the way: 2016 was 9 years ago. With a life expectancy of 78 years and a voting age of 18 a bigger part of those who voted for Brexit have already died. No one under 27 was even able to vote. The migrant population also had no vote here)
I agree.
There is a lot of BS about setting an example and punishing them, but I have not seen anyone who actually knows how the process works say anything remotely like that.
It would also be a massive case of the EU cutting off it's nose to spite it's face. That's just not how the EU rolls.
The normal process of joining has requirements geared towards poor peripheral countries that the UK already meets or exceeds.
The UK can join anytime it wishes and there is even a lot of room to negotiate mutually beneficial terms.
I do think it would be fair to require them to adopt the Euro this time around, for example. But even if that doesn't happen as long as everyone is better with the UK in then it's worth it.
Any country joining the EU pledges to join the euro, but there are no deadlines defined and there is little animo to push countries to join, but technically it's part of the deal.
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Don't put all people of the UK in the same basket please.
We are stronger if we are united. Vengeance against all for being misled by the brexit liars is not productive.
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We do, but we need to set an example. You can't have it look like some club you can just enter and exit just like that. You have got to discourage other countries from trying to leave. Essentially the UK has to come crawling back on their knees and take a bad deal that gets better for them year after year or smth.
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Your mistake: modesty.
The fuckers pushing Brexit were extremely immodest liars.
If they want to rejoin they should break up and let the individual countries become members. So if England wants to get out again it doesnβt drag Scotland and Northern Ireland with it against their will. Those two countries voted remain.
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Let's just switch UK with Hungary.
Or, let's punch Orban in the face and have both Hungary and UK as members.
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Hindsight is 20/20.
However in this case, it was furiously obvious that this was gonna happen even before the vote. All you needed was to inform yourself and think a little bit.
And even if you didn't, James Acaster spelled out the simplest, most obvious and most sensible argument against Brexit ever said.
If tea wouldn't convince the British, nothing would
The graph gap between 0 and 30 irritates me. The 50 60 looks so high up.
I would have preferred 20 to 80 or 20 to 60 or 0 to 100.
I'm very happy when people start their graphs at 0. Starting at any other number is an easy way to "lie with statistics".
I keenly remember how one of the things the Leavers were pushing as a benefit of leaving the EU was to be able to get closer to the US. Oopsie...
Yet another in a long line of bollocks from the Brexiters, swallowed by a large percentage of the British Electorate (not just in the Referendum but even in Parliamentary Elections after it where they repeatedly voted the Leave leaders into Government).
Mind you, as somebody who left the country after that (I was an EU immigrant over there for more than a decade) I still look at Britain as guide for the rest of Europe, since they seem to have been 10 years ahead of most of Europe in their sliding towards Fascism (their version of it is led by millionaire/billionaire posh boys rather than nouveau riche construction magnates like in the US, but it's still the same kind of ideology)
Come back and lose all previous privileges.
And, that's still a good deal, actually.
It's a great deal. Go on the Euro, be a normal member and have the huge ~~death~~ dearth of benefits from the single market that the UK benefitted from for generations. It's a huge win for the UK if the EU would be that generous.
Maybe we'd finally do a full metric switch instead of this bullshit 80% effort
"How to unsink the titanic, pls help"
My conspiracy hat on, the only reason the right to leave was high was due to Russian interference. Now that their interests are focused elsewhere and they're being sanctioned to high shit what you're seeing now is the real results. Britain was never overwhelmingly for Brexit.
That's my conspiracy anyways.
That's not a conspiracy IMO. Dividing the west is on their agenda clear and open.
They stopped because they got what they wanted, the UK left, what are they going to do, leave more :-) ?
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A bunch of leavers probably died of covid.
As there's gradually enough distance that people can claim it wasn't their idea, more and more of will be willing to admit it was a really bad one.
I love that sudden change in attitude the moment they actually leave. shows how once something actually happens, your instinct of denial kicks in, hoping you did the right thing even if you thought it was wrong before. didn't last long of course.
As a political topic Brexit is becoming less and less relevant.
While people are regretting leaving, there is definitely not a clamouring to rejoin. The EU is barely discussed by politicians.
Rejoining would be without the opt outs the UK had so an actual debate on rejoining probably wouldn't get enough support to rejoin. It would just be a toxic rerun of the brexit debate.
I dont see this being a political topic again for at least 10 years unless something dramatically changes. And if Le Pen becomes president of France, or AFD gain a share of power in Germany joining the EU may become even more politically toxic.
I wanted to remain, and I regret leaving but leaving has not been as disaterous as expected. Its not been good either but we can live with it.
And the best effect ironically is politicans are not incessantly fighting about the EU. I'm glad they are focusing on other issues now; the years around and after the brexit referendum were horrendous and factional. At least now the politicians are focused on the UKs actual issues such as public service and the economy.
Yeah, if rejoining happens, it's going to be at a point where Brexit is ancient history in political terms. This shouldn't really be downvoted.
It was a dumb decision, but a deeply democratic one, and rolling it back isn't a good look to say the least.
damn leopards again
No second Brexit?
I knew a guy in Wales who was sick of constantly having to tell people he told them so after a few years.
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